Protesters gather at Richmond offices of Webb, Warner
ALEXA WELCH EDLUND/TIMES-DISPATCH
About 200 protesters marched in front of the downtown Richmond offices of Sen. Jim Webb, D-Va.
Protesting against President Barack Obama’s health-care and cap-and-trade proposals, several hundred Virginians gathered today outside the Richmond area offices of Sens. Jim Webb, D-Virginia, and Mark R. Warner, D-Virginia.
Pickets organized by the Richmond Tea Party and Americans for Prosperity chanted slogans and waved signs to urge the two senators to vote against the proposals.
Neither senator was present.
“Webb vote no, or you will go!“ the crowd outside Webb’s downtown Richmond office chanted.
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Blaine, for someone who isn’t going to waste time refuting point by point on a reply to Jer1234, your posting sure was long. No way you typed that in 2 minutes. But you and Jer have certainly kept us all entertained.
Blaine each to his own. I stand by all my statements. You can take them any way you want.
Jer1234- I won’t waste time refuting your last post point by point because you already know everything anyway. It’s just too filled with assumptions, accusations, unsupported allegations and factual errors for me to waste much time with it. But it’s clear to anyone reading my posts that I’ve never maligned military service but respect and applaud it. If that wasn’t clear to anyone then of course I apologize, but also hope that what I’ve written is read in full. I haven’t insulted military service, past or current, as you claim; I’ve clearly stated the importance and respect it deserves. If anything, I don’t believe the pay and benefits are adequate while on Active Duty and the case is even worse for former military personnel regardless of his or her length of service. But I only saw you write in the past tense, as if that was all that was needed so now you’ve earned the right to just rest on your laurels, except when you take time to perpetuate misconceptions and insult anyone who doesn’t agree with your myopic view. You took great offense when I said that service to nation is a life-long requirement. The things you react so strongly to say a great deal about you, just as it would with me, and the Medical establishment has a term for it, or several terms actually.
Also, I haven’t insulted everyone with a college degree that isn’t a “Liberal Arts” degree. First, it’s actually called a Bachelor of Arts Degree (BA) as opposed to a Bachelor of Science Degree (BS) or a Medical Degree (MD). College Degrees fall under separate “Schools” and “Colleges” within a University and/or Medical College or Law School. A BA degree simply means that the Humanities form the widest part of the degrees’ base requirements as opposed to the mathematics and sciences that are required for a career in business, law, medicine, engineering or any field in science. That’s all it is but apparently you’ve forgotten that since your college days.
And now to one of your posts to me that showed surprisingly less factual ignorance than your follow-up comments:
I wrote: “Again, thanks for your service to this nation but for a true American
citizen service doesn’t end when you leave the military- it’s a life long
calling. Man up and do your part.“
Read that again, slowly; just where do you see an insult to military service? I’m confident that not a lot of people would read it that way. Guess that does make your discernment something special after all!
“That is the problem with your type.”
My type? If the best you can do is lump me in with others as a type then I suppose words must’ve failed you.
“You think anyone who strives to change things for the better are the only true citizens.”
Another assumption, but this is a rare instance where your assumption is partly correct; people who strive to make change for the good of all are true citizens. Nowhere have I said that excludes Military Service. Read your statement closely and you’ll see that you’re stating that people who try to change things for the better aren’t true Americans. Who owes whom an apology?
“You have the b***s to question me without providing any of your background or service to this country.”
Actually, I haven’t questioned you about anything. I stated my position and that seems to have struck a nerve; your problem to deal with, not mine. And frankly, it doesn’t matter who you or I are; the truth doesn’t change no matter how much you wish it would.
“I say to you , Blaine. that [sic] you have just insulted every military person who has served this country. The truest way to be a citizen of this country is to serve to
protect its citizens and Constitution.”
Actually, Jer1234, I’ve done just the opposite. If you don’t think so then offer some proof for that claim and of why you insult me, and so many others who serve their country in ways other than Military service. Your logic excludes teachers, doctors, dentists, lawyers and, well, EVERYONE else who hasn’t served in the Military. You owe a really big apology to a few hundred million people, so- where is it?
“You are a true insult to the citizens and the freedoms of this country. Please apologize to all who have served in the military and continue to serve this country after they get out.”
Your reasoning never ceases to amaze me! Deluded thinking would be a kind way to describe your expressed beliefs.
And this is it for me; I just don’t care for talking to the equivalent of the proverbial brick wall.
No saying that you hve no idea who I am means yo keep making assumptions about me that have no basis in fact. As far as other things yes you are trying to change my life by forcing more taxes on me for people who don’t have insurance, forcing more taxes on me for owning 61% of GM and for passing a cap and trade bill that will increase my electric bills and other expenditures by an ungodly amount.
Of course you show your true nature when you say “ I made the assumption that you didn’t attend college because you don’t write as one who has a broad base Liberal Arts education.“ That to me explains your nature very well. Yo sit and demean the mitlitary now you say tha without a Liberal Arts degree I could not have attended college. What about all those other degrees that can be obtained through a college degree. Very good nice way of insulting all who have degree other than a “Liberal Arts” degree.
You are right about some of our programs being listed under socialism and look how well they are doing. Those in Washington are steam rolling a complete take over of our health care system by the government.
You can make all the claims you want but that is the way it is. Why else are they in a hurry to get this passed before the August break? Are they afraid of what the voters will say when they get back to their states? I think so as a CNN poll today said 59% of people said they do not want this program.
I have no problem with health care reform as long as it is true reform. All these current reforms will do is raise the national debt, put upwards to 50% of the country on government health program, add more government bueracracy and will cause taxes to increase. What about true reform that brings down prices, contols government and insurance intervention and allows the patient to make a decision about their care?
My Government health care (what there is of it) and my pension are items I earned for my time served. It is not a hand out for not working or paying into the system. Again you show your beliefs by demeaning people to make your point.
Can you gaurantee those reforms the CBO want will be in the bill passed? I can’t and neither can anybody else so using them to make a point is a mute point until they are passed. Look at the bill passed by committee.
Comparing the cost of health care to wars fought in the last 8 years is a wrong comparison. How about comparing it to the war in Afganistan that Mr Obama and the current Congress is escalating? What is the cost of that war compared to the future cost of health care?
“Labels divide by de-humanizing other people so beware of those who do that; they’re really the ones who want to change your way of life.“
You should pay close attention to your own words. They speak well for a Liberal Arts degree gradute.
Jer1234- you’re correct saying that I have no idea who you are since I know no more about you than what you’ve posted here. Saying “You have no idea who I am” implies a sense of superiority over those whom you say it and often precdes a threat of some sort. I made the assumption that you didn’t attend college because you don’t write as one who has a broad base Liberal Arts education. I’m certainly not trying to change your life. As for those who lead the country now I can only hope they don’t back down under popular pressure. Yes, reforming the broken healthcare system requires “radical” measures, but also is long overdue.
And living under socialism? We already do. Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, VA benefits, highways… well the list of “socialist” programs goes on but you get the point. No one in Washington is pushing for a single-payer system, just for reform, and reform means competition. All elected (Federal) representatives and Federal Employees already have the same type of healthcare plan that’s being planned for all citizens. Its also the kind of government program that fits your “socialist” definition. Are you aware of any instances where that part of socialism has hurt you? You seem to have done well in your life under those burdens of socialism. I would hope you’re not one of those “I got mine, so !@*! everyone else” kind of people. I’m not aware that anyone is trying to change your way of life even if that is a claim often heard on talk radio. Have you or do you expect to benefit from military healthcare, retirement pay (since you served twenty years), social security or, hopefully not, medicare, or do you intend to turn your monthly payments to the U.S. Treasury general fund since it’s “socialism” providing the funds from taxpayers’ dollars? If you believe the cost will drive up your taxes look at it this way: even if the major cost-cutting reforms recommended by the CBO (which as you know is separate from Congress) expanding the Federal System to everyone will add approx. 240B to the national debt over ten years. Many of the reforms advocated by the CBO will be in the bill that the President eventually signs; Blue Dog dems and most republicans will make sure of it. In the worse case scenario, the cost will be about the same as the one year cost of the two wars fought for the last 8 years. In other words, just a single year’s war expenditures would pay the entire ten year cost of expanded healthcare coverage. If it has to be paid for with tax increases then unless you’re among the richest 1% of all Americans, your tax rate won’t go up. As for me saying you’re an unthinking person, I took that from the stands you take and the fact that you blithely label entire groups of people as socialist America-haters, and say that specifically to a lot of people on this post, including me. Labels divide by de-humanizing other people so beware of those who do that; they’re really the ones who want to change your way of life.
“Again, thanks for your service to this nation but for a true American citizen service doesn’t end when you leave the military- it’s a life long calling. Man up and do your part.“
I saved this for a seperate entry. Where do you get off questioning whether I am a true American citizen and my service to the country. That is the problem with your type. You think anyone who strives to change things for the better are the only true citizens. The next time you question my or anyones elses continuing service to this country you better know a whole lot mpre about them. You have the b***s to question me without providing any of your background or service to this country. I say to you , Blaine. that you have just insulted every military person who has served this country. The truest way to be a citizen of this country is to serve to protect its citizens and Constitution. You are a true insult to the citizens and the freedoms of this country. Please apologize to all who have served in the military and continue to serve this country after they get out.
Blaine, You still have no idea who I am. I have had higher education becasue I do have a college degree. So again you make many accusations about me that you know nothing about. If my ideas are so radical and extremist what do you call those that are leading the country now?
You have no right or need to tell me how to live my life, or suggest I am unthinking. I will place my life experiences up against anybodies and use it to make up my statements and beliefs. For you to say other wise proves that if one is not in step with your ideas then they are uneducated, extreme and unthinking. I stick by my statements and accusations of people like you who have no idea what living under socialism will do to this country. Please find some other way to make your point as I am proud of my life and do not see any reason to change it. Why are you and others trying to change it for me?
greta- it’s good to hear from you and I share your hopes and sentiments that healthcare reform will, eventually at least, help us all.
Jer1234- you seem rather proud of your accomplishments, perhaps for good reason. Thank you for defending the right of free speech; for that you’re to be commended. That said, perhaps you should’ve bothered to get some higher education for yourself and then you’d realize that you’re simply spouting the same tiresome, useless and dangerous non-facts so popular on talk radio. Not agreeing with you doesn’t make one a socialist. I certainly don’t hate America and I’m not a “socialist” (you seem to spit that word out dripping with venom) but I am disappointed that this nation isn’t what I was raised to think that it is. The goals represented by the American flag, and fought for by people such as you are laudatory, but not yet universal throughout America. There are many who serve to protect our freedoms and this nation without serving in the military- perhaps you, too, can find a way to continue that service. You, sir, are not the end all and be all so stop claiming such perfection and perhaps develop a conscience to counter-act the hate you seem to revel in. And I, too, stand by my accusation that you’re little more than an unthinking mouthpiece for extreme, yes I said extreme, positions of the “old guard” controlled by corporate interests. Again, thanks for your service to this nation but for a true American citizen service doesn’t end when you leave the military- it’s a life long calling. Man up and do your part.
I am 30 and have worked 8 campaigns, hardcore, in my short life. That equals hating America?
What exactly is it YOU do?
I am glad you asked. I am 58 years old and served for 20 years in the military during which time I participated in the Vietnam War, the Lebonon Crisis, the Akili Laru kidnapping and was intensely involved in the bombing of the Marine HQ in Beirut. Since then I am now working with a local law enforcment agency. I have raised two kids who both have gone through college and graduated with no student loans. I have no bills other than those common to all people like utility, taxes and oyher monthly items. My house is paid off as is all three of my cars.
I to have participated in various ways in campaigns through out my life but they had more to do with protecting your right to express your opinion in a public newspaper.
Because you are 30 years old and worked 8 campaigns tells me that you are heavy into politics and are not to be trusted. It is the politicians in this world who have led us to all the major conflicts that have occured. They are also the ones who turn our Constitution around in ways it was never meant to be as they are only out for themselves. So yes I say people like you hate America becasue you think your changes to Socialism will help all the downtrodden people of the world instead of providing them with opportunity. You think it is fair to take my hard earned money and give it to those who do not deserve it. You want to take crimminals and give them citizenship so you will have more people to give money to so they will rely on your political backing for their daily bread, Yes you hate America because you would deliver our country into the hands of those who would put us under the tumb of tyranny in the name of the good of the people.
So when your life experiences equal mine then you can accuse me of anything you want but not with what you know now. I stand by my accusation.
Again I have defended your right to make statements like you do in a public forum. How have you defended our freedoms and Constitution?
WoW-Don’t be too concerned. I understand well enough for both of us.
The world can seem like an ‘insane’ place when one gets out of one’s own comfort zone.
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